With education reform a hotly debated topic nationally, two leaders with the SCVi charter school, discussed goals and outcomes this week with U.S. Secretary Betsy DeVos.

DeVos has been a somewhat of a polarizing force in the education reform discussion: Her arrival, coming from outside the traditional education ranks, has been seen by many opposed to systemic reform as a concern; many of her supporters hope her “outsider” views and lack of affiliation to rank-and-file union interests represent a positive sea-change for reform that both sides seem to agree is necessary.

Amber Raskin and Dawn Evenson, co-founders of iLead organization, which includes the first charter school they opened, SCVi, were there more to discuss their classrooms models, goals and how charter schools often meet unique needs, as opposed to policy.

Raskin and Evenson were encouraged by DeVos’ openness and thirst for perspective.

“She was very interested in hearing about what we do at iLead schools,” Raskin said, “I think some of our missions really resonated with her.”

One of their biggest takeaways was her passion for children and their well being, Evenson said.

“She has a heart for the kids, and everybody that we saw close to her really felt that way,” Evenson said. “She’s motivated by trying to do stuff for the kids.”

Whether the student is a high-achieving statistical outlier or a student who struggles for a variety of reasons, charter schools provide important options or choices, they said. One of the reasons they wanted to be a part of the conversation, not just as the only representing the only Center for Education Reform invitee from California, was to discuss how the innovation takes place, and how regulation can jeopardize that.

DeVos appeared interested in hearing about different ways to take a “holistic” approach to education, and many of those representing alternatives to tradition sought to share their own takes on this. There were several models discussed, including the “no excuses” model, the online model, the for-profit and, for Raskin and Evenson, the nonprofit model.

The CER members from the public charter school sector, such as SCVi, would like to see a loosening of some of the regulations in California, which have made the type of innovations through which charter schools have been able to thrive.

If the charter schools are charged with the same regulations as public schools but with a smaller percentage of funding (a percentage of the ADA dollars go to the chartering school district for oversight) and similar regulation, then the innovative approaches that have been charter school cornerstones become much more difficult, Evenson said. “We were there representing the project-based learning and blended learning models. We we re there to carry that flag.”

For Raskin and Evenson, who operate schools in several different socioeconomic environments, from Castaic to Pacoima, it’s not just about economics, as their schools seek to help low- and high-income populations while building positive outcomes for students with different needs and a style that suits the student best. The ability to innovate is key in that process, and where regulation can prove stifling, they noted.

“(The CER members and DeVos) had a conversation about going back to the roots of charter schools,” Raskin added. “School innovation is one of those roots, and bureaucracy is not.”